Regular Called Meeting

Speaker 1

0:00 Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I'd like I'd like to call the regular scheduled Planning Commission meeting of Tuesday, April 7 to order. Roll call. I'm here. Jeremy's here. Here. Ruth's here. David's here. Steve's here. Everybody's here. Okay. So we have a quorum. More than a quorum. Approval of minutes. Any any comments on the minutes that Vivian sent out? What?

0:37 Approval of minutes? No. Certainly would. Just Everyone approve the motion? Approve the minutes? Aye. We don't need to have a motion on that. Okay. Report from the chair. Meeting of attention requirement. I think Charles Dyson sent out, this note to everyone based on what the attorney had sent us about what our requirements are.

Speaker 3

0:54 Do you want to comment on that? I just want to stress that if we have a joint public hearing, that is considered a meeting of the Planning Commission. That so that counts as a meeting of Planning Commission.

Speaker 2

1:07 And we have one on Thursday. We have one on Thursday. Yeah.

Speaker 1

1:11 In the in the in the details that he sent you, it says that you you can only miss let's see. Let's see. Let's Let's do four. Let's if

1:32 of means goes up to 16 and you can miss three that goes to four. If we have eight and I don't know how many joint public hearings we have but I think it's probably closer to eight than to six.

Speaker 3

1:43 It's not a percentage. State code right here it is right here, fifteen two twenty two twelve. You cannot miss be absent from any four meeting of the commission within a twelve month period. With or without an excuse.

Speaker 5

1:56 Right? Correct.

Speaker 1

1:57 Well, not you can have an if you are well, you know, with an excuse. But if you're attending remotely, that counts if you have a bad remote excuse. Correct. Yeah. So everyone got this memo from Charles. Right? Okay. And oh, I was gonna that's the end of our meeting. We do we first of all, we need a quorum for that, not to mention people meeting their obligations. Who's raise your hands if you're available for Thursday's joint public hearing. Oh, excellent.

2:25 You have more than a quorum. Great. Done with that item. Okay. That was all I had. Okay, public hearing, this is a separate meeting.

Speaker 3

2:37 Public hearing on the Cup 226 Coleman. That is to operate a short term rental at 55 York Road. The designated local agent is Heather Bristol.

2:57 I have not received any, no. I think there was one negative, statement out of

Speaker 1

3:07 You sent how many? 11 letters. Because he has sent out 11 letters. You only had one. It was negative. Correct. No supports? You were presumed to support. I didn't know anything. I just wondering if anyone supported. No. What was the negative reason?

Speaker 3

3:21 You know, the traffic, not knowing people,

Speaker 1

3:25 that kind of thing. Okay. Not much traffic back there. Was a was it a neighbor next door or a couple of houses? A couple a couple away. Okay.

3:36 And do you have any recommendations on this CUP? I have no objection to it being granted. Okay. And how how many if it's granted, how many STRs would that make? This will be 33

Speaker 3

3:48 asterisk, though. Charles and I are going through all of them again now. Think everybody gets audited to make sure that they're doing everything they're supposed to be doing, and I know of at least three or four that will fall off. Okay. So way under the 35.

Speaker 6

4:04 Okay. Of nonpayment or because they quit? They went long

Speaker 1

4:09 term. Okay. Okay. Is there a motion? Any questions? We should ask for public comments. Alright. Is that where we are? Yes. This is a public hearing. Any any comments from the public on the York Road STR? 55 York Road?

4:28 Okay. Any motion from the Planning Commission?

4:36 Move to approve. Okay. I second.

Speaker 5

4:38 Okay.

Speaker 1

4:41 To recommend approval.

4:46 Okay. Any other discussion? Okay. Roll call vote.

Speaker 3

4:54 Aye. Jeremy.

Speaker 2

4:58 Ruth, I. Marston, aye. David,

Speaker 5

5:02 aye. Steve, aye.

Speaker 8

5:04 David, aye.

Speaker 1

5:05 I'm an aye. Okay. It's unanimously we recommend approval unanimously. The motion in minutes reflect that Planning Commission is recommending approval. Since we actually can't approve.

5:23 Public comment on any other issue?

5:31 Once. Going twice. Okay no public comment. Thank you. Report from the town administrator.

Speaker 3

5:39 We have a permit permitted house teardown, tax map 3343, which is at 20 Cross Trees Lane. Renovate the exterior of 55 York Road, whom you just voted on, removal of some trees in the RPA at 22 Waller, and construct a new carport at 413 That Lane. Upcoming will be a redevelopment in the RPA at 49 And 96 Rentals Landing Road. I've already been out there a lot with Board of Zoning Appeals members, Planning Commission members, Town Council members. If anybody wants to go, please call my office, and we will go.

6:22 And that's the public hearing at this Thursday's meeting? That is. First reading of that conditional use permit will be this Thursday. And then there are your applicants. The priggards are the applicants. And we're Vivian's neighbors. Okay.

Speaker 8

6:36 So she's got to be nice to me.

Speaker 1

6:44 I think it's unusual when it's the old crab house down the end of Reynolds Road and so The redevelopment is because there's paving all over the place there and they're going to have less than impervious surface than there is now. The only issue at all is the setbacks to build there reasonably. You probably have to change our 25 foot side setbacks to something less. What are they proposing? 12? 12. Yeah. And

Speaker 5

7:14 Or 10? I thought it 12. Whatever. But you're

Speaker 1

7:20 and that that's a boarding zoning appeals issue, not ours. Mhmm. K. But it's two separate lots. Right? Mhmm. Yeah. And you're gonna put a house on one lot and a house on the other lot because you can't put a guest house on a lot anymore or couldn't. Okay. Okay. Whole business. David and Ruth, the 154 apartment language.

Speaker 9

7:50 Yeah. I think something we looked at, when we were kind of going over these was I will start out by saying we wanted to recommend very broad language, because a lot of times when you look into any of this, you start getting into other crevices of our code that we have not come into agreement on, such as building sizes, etc. But one important distinction I think we wanted to make was that we wanted to clarify that we're talking about multi use in the village, because there are lots that are technically waterfront.

8:32 And if we are ever in a situation where we have multi use that would also be waterfront, that would obviously have its own unique needs and regulations

Speaker 6

8:44 around it. Yeah. That would include residential and then some other use? No. No. It's B one. It's only B one. B one. There's

Speaker 5

8:50 not a lot of them. But But there are some. There are some. And we we couldn't figure out how to do it. The rest of it is I mean, we can obviously amend the the code as it is and just add it. I think it's a, number 21 and just put in we'll allow an apartment in the above and at the rear and I can write the language. But we really can't figure out what to do about the waterfront so we figured we'd come and talk to you people and say what you think.

9:18 Because there are some places that can have a business and then the size of the building can be fairly large and then we can say one apartment or an apartment in the code and then somebody's got a house on top of a building. So and they've got waterfront.

Speaker 9

9:40 So it's sort of a so it just gets into other areas too. Like, let's say there's a, you know, space in the water that's being developed that would want to be mixed use, then is there different height restrictions around building because you don't want the residential space above David's Point suddenly being aloft residential space above the building and blocking out more of a view than is reasonable for the business that would have originally been there.

10:08 It just it gets really murky really fast. This only applies though to there's

Speaker 1

10:14 no B1s on the waterfront. There's M1s. Yeah there's M1s. I don't know of a B1. Well I don't know what's Crockett's Landing? Is that a B1? M1. That's an M1 also. So that's an M1, Custom Yachts is an M1 and Russell Harper's properties are M1 right? Mhmm. That that's really it. But that's something versus something. No. Anyway, we could I'm just thinking out loud here, but we could

Speaker 9

10:40 write whatever we think is appropriate for for the b ones in town where most of them are. That's what we're saying is I that would be the suggestion is to focus on that that this is for that specifically and then just kind of leave it to what would unfold later of kind of working around that because we don't know what that

Speaker 1

10:58 discussion would be. I I kinda like the idea of just restricting it from those and they can apply later. Sanders He had an apartment. On the building they ripped down he had in his zoning permit he had the ability to put an apartment over top of his office building which would have been the 2nd Floor of the office building actually when he just changed the office. He had that in there and when they ripped down the building I don't know whether that carries on to Russell or not but I would say let's just somehow restrict it out of the waterfront properties.

11:30 Okay.

Speaker 5

11:30 That's what we were starting with. What language would not be unconstitutional by saying only inland or Isn't that spot zoning?

Speaker 3

11:40 I I don't know. Know, zoning is more than I'm So the issue is our zoning cascades. So the the first thing of M 1 says anything that you can do in r one B one b two you can do in M 1. This is why the issue occurs. Right. So you could accept, you know In the b one code. Multifamily in in M 1. And then I

Speaker 9

12:07 think for the time being, I my suggestion would be just to keep it clean would be anything that we want to propose adding, just stipulating that this is intended for the village inland areas. Not saying and none of the other, just saying these restrictions are around this because I do not worry that if someone were thinking about even building something mixed use down there that we wouldn't hear about it. There wouldn't be discussions then just so we're not creating weird

Speaker 1

12:41 corners. Guess I would not suggest, is that you draft something up and run it by the attorney before you bring it back to the Planning Commission. Mhmm. Because if there's if there's a problem with with it in terms of zoning, she she would know or be able to find out quicker than we could. Right? Yeah. And if you would send that to me so I can send it Okay. The

Speaker 5

13:00 Good. I mean, this is basically adding Yep. A permitted use is all we're doing. It's not Exactly. Very complicated. It's just how you word it. It's gonna be a problem. Right. Now we did spend the Planning Commission did spend a lot of time on ADU discussions. Mhmm. And we're and we're kind of now adding

Speaker 7

13:17 ADUs to be one. Really? Sort of. Could be. Well, we're just their auxiliary

Speaker 5

13:24 they're they're auxiliary is in that center. They have to be part of the building, so I don't think it's auxiliary. Have to be or behind connected. Right. Has to be connected. Right. It has to be connected. And we have them now. And

Speaker 1

13:35 some people say, well, we have them, therefore, they're allowed. But we elect We also have tourist cabins and other things. So we're just trying also have ADUs now. Where do you have ADUs? Just they're I think they're in some in town. Yeah. No. That okay. They're not We're not gonna we're not we're we're not trying to they're all grandfathered. Yep. Yes. We're not trying to have any more of those built. This we're we're saying we wanna allow someone if they build an office building to put an apartment over.

14:01 Understand. Alright. Yeah. So I don't see I don't see that. I'm just worried that the town council may not wanna go down this route again. Well, okay. That's an interesting point. Yeah. When we get the language together, we'll present it in that way though. I think I think we we talked to Town Council about this and I think the discussion was they see the need to have the code more clear in this way as opposed to someone building an office building an apartment over top of it and then saying coming for approval and having the town say you can't do that.

14:31 That was really what we're trying to do. I mean, it's a good it's a good question, but I think I think we're okay on that and we'll find out. Any other discussion of that issue? So it I'll give it to you. Hopefully, by the next meeting, we'll have the language that the lawyer and you guys think is appropriate. Okay. Next meeting on Thursday, but the 1AM. Correct. Next month. Our our meeting. Our official meeting. They're all official meetings. Our regularly scheduled meetings.

15:02 Perfect. Yeah. Okay. We already voted on We voted on the cup. Capital plan, we owe this to the Budget and Finance Committee. I got the guidance on. You guys will have a copy of this right in front of you? Anyone in the back want one of these things? I'll

Speaker 8

15:23 take one.

Speaker 7

15:25 Refresh me.

Speaker 1

15:26 When does it have to be given to them? The budget finance committee and the person of Kay requested that we have it back to them before hopefully before the the Thursday Town Council meeting because she's having the the budget discussion prior to that, the draft budget. Okay. That's what you desire. Correct, Kay? Correct.

Speaker 10

15:49 I would like to be able to present in the workshop the budget that reflects the best information that we have Right. Which includes whatever you all Right. Talk about. So that's why we're doing it tonight. And

Speaker 1

16:02 we could have been prepared for this earlier if I had bothered with that, but I didn't. Okay. I I gone over a lot of the items that I wasn't clear on with Phil who was involved in a bunch of these things and had insight and in other things I talked to a few other people. So first off for the sewer, A comprehensive plan we spent a little money, we put money in a couple years out there just if we want to revise the thing. We don't have any current plans to revise any of it but The comprehensive plan is supposed to be revised to be considered every five years but you can revise it anytime you want.

16:47 If we see things some years that we think it's worth revising the comprehensive plan we should do that. That's why there's some money in there but we haven't really spent any. Sewer. I talked about this before. Basically the whole town sewer at $9,800,000 That's just outside the budgetary capability of the town. The town center sewer which is the one that we thought maybe possibly be done the $3,500,000 is really beyond what the council would like to do I think so we're waiting to see what happens there.

17:25 There's some development in town that might do some money on that, knock it down to where with additional private contributions maybe we could propose doing it but we're not there at this point. So it's priority three. By the way, let me just review that. Where did I put that thing? So we're going through this a couple of things I want to make sure that we all understand.

Speaker 2

17:48 So those cash flows in that line aren't realistic?

Speaker 1

17:52 If we did that project and there may be enough development in the next months where next year we might do something which is why there's only $10 in there and then four. Assumes that's possible. Let's talk estimate quality. We've got ballpark which means there's some initial scope estimate and cost estimate for similar work or wild guesses. Preliminary estimate means we've got good scope and a professional estimate. Budgetary estimate means we've got well defined scope and a professional estimate.

18:26 Quote means we've got a defined scope and a quote from a qualified provider. One the things when we're going through this we want to understand what our quality of the estimates are then priorities. Priorities are one is most important and we're recommending funding first on the base of available funds. We might think it's worth doing in the next calendar year but if there's not enough money to do it it doesn't get done. Next line, number two. Next in line, assuming the scope and the estimate holds and there's available funds and or grants.

18:58 And three was you need further definition before because of other issues before you can even get a scope and that's why the Town Center sewer line is three. And I'm not sure what you call the whole town sewer. Can I get a that's it? Oh, is it one of these? Yeah. You didn't get one? No. It was online. It's different. Yes. This is this is updated. The one online was well, this is the one online, actually. The one I sent out. Okay. K. Anyway okay. That takes us through sewer.

19:34 Commons development. We had in the budget the we took out the additional trees that were planted through the Rappahannock River Foundation, our friends of the Rappahannock because it's been done. We had money in there, were of the discussions before of the Commons about additional landscaping. I'm not sure right now that the town has any plans for additional landscaping there. There's drainage issues which are in the other comms development things but I don't know whether the town even sees the need for additional stuff there.

20:13 Did that include sort of the hardscape and the rendering of that common area? I mean 75 k would be a lot of landscaping. Did it include other elements? It included other things and that's why it says over in comments it said it's a it's a second two priority needs more definition. I don't really I don't at this point know whether there is much definition of it. Maybe ask one of the council members. Okay. Is there is there any definition of what additional stuff we would do in the commons besides the the drainage and those issues?

20:46 I think it's the from the master plan that was developed by Four Winds. Yes. Yeah. That whole rendering. Right. But there's no action right now to do any of that is there?

Speaker 10

21:00 There's nothing in the budget to do any of that right now. So that's why it's in the capital budget is that it's something that could be done and it would be a major investment.

Speaker 1

21:09 I guess I'd recommend we leave it in at the $75 because there isn't any more estimate. Could actually just take it out but I think it's been enough background on it I'd recommend we leave it in and call it a priority two. It's either a two or a three. Would I say a three one?

Speaker 2

21:29 Does it matter what year we put it in? No.

Speaker 1

21:33 No. Well, I think if we're gonna do something what we're gonna do. If they're gonna do something, I think they'd probably do some of it this year, and I left left most of it in the other year. Yep. Yeah. Actually, I have 81 there, don't I? Priority twos just seem to me that, like, they come later afterwards. Yeah. No. They clearly do. And and and Yeah. So I'm an active plan. And and you define what you're trying to do, you can't make it a one. Mhmm.

21:58 So the sixth may not spend any money this year. Okay. Common drainage issue Commons drainage issues in Tavern Road sidewalk. These are kind of linked together. Phil's done a lot of work with this, I think, Justin, you've been involved in this with VDOT. Right? Talking about the sidewalk on Tavern Road. And there was there was a study done by someone. You had a grant for someone coming in and studying the drainage on the commons. Is that right, Kay?

Speaker 10

22:27 Yes. That's the stormwater runoff grant. Yeah. Yeah. But

Speaker 1

22:31 they basically didn't recommend a whole lot, did they? They

Speaker 10

22:36 had recommendations of different things they could do, yes. I there's report from them. I

Speaker 1

22:45 talked to Phil about this a little bit and I think the things that make sense there are there's storm water sewer in town. It runs down King Carter Drive basically and then into the creek. If we're going to do any additional drainage on the commons on the Tavern Road side, we're going to put a sidewalk in, might put a pipe under there that ran into that drainage system. So this is again it's a two I think. And that can take the extra capacity? Yeah, storm drain system.

23:20 Yeah. That's the that capacity is not a problem, big pipe. But I guess I I would call that a two because it's not that that well defined and it's not clear when we would do it. Can

Speaker 7

23:31 can we comment on the items? Everything, please. Yeah. What is the benefit of a sidewalk on Tavern Road? Because there's not one on Chesapeake. It's not a busy road. Walk down the middle of it anytime anytime of day you want.

Speaker 4

23:47 What's the reason for a sidewalk? Comment on that? The only reason you put a sidewalk down Tavern Road is if you had an interceptor sewer that that's why this kinda one of the reasons the sidewalk exists down King Carter is because there's a 18 to 24 inch drainage pipe underneath it that the sidewalk covers. If we chose to do that on Tavern Road to drain some of the water off Tavern Road, the best way that's when you put a sidewalk up it to to to cover Cover the storm drain.

24:21 Little And

Speaker 1

24:21 bit of safety to have that there but think people walk down into the road anyway. Just

Speaker 4

24:27 putting a sidewalk up Cavern Road to say putting a sidewalk up Tavern Road is probably We

Speaker 1

24:32 we wouldn't low priority. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Might not make the list that way. So, yeah, that that's why the sidewalk and the drainage is together. And one of the questions is is the town gonna do any more on on draining the commons? After big rains stuff you have a problem but it fades away in a few days. I don't think that's something the town is likely to spend money on. There's also the Chesapeake Bank lot is hardscape. Well, not hardscape, it's asphalt.

25:05 So that has drainage on one side of it. So one of the other ways that we would one of the other work you would do here was you might collect that water as it runs off there and put that in an interceptor also. So that's why that scope isn't really well defined and I guess I'd say it's really a two at this point almost for lack of definition if anything. But there's some meetings with VDOT that will help get that. The next item is kind of a new one.

25:29 Have the storage building issue the Town's been dealing with for All

Speaker 3

25:34 the

Speaker 1

25:35 years I've been on the Planning Commission and probably before that. And so a Phil and Heather have purchased the Lowry property which is right next to the museum. It also includes a lot behind the museum. And so they've made an offer to the town which is now public and they will talk about that at the Thursday meeting where they're offering to sell that lot to the town for a certain amount of money. I think it's $85 or so. And that would allow the town to put a shed of a large sized storage building on that property to eliminate the VIA building and also store all the stuff that the town pays to store somewhere else.

26:25 Called it a one. It's maybe a little better than a ballpark right now. What would you say that the quality of that estimate would be by our definitions, Phil? What

Speaker 4

26:36 estimate of what? The I would say buying the

Speaker 1

26:39 buying the property and building a storage building. Well,

Speaker 4

26:43 I'm not gonna comment on the property because I have a conflict of interest here, obviously. So

Speaker 10

26:48 I believe you put 90,000 in

Speaker 1

26:50 for this year. Is that correct? 190. Yeah. I put 9 no. I put 90 in for this year. It seems really So the 90 I'm confused. Okay. Well, go ahead, Faith. Finish back. Essentially is

Speaker 10

27:00 to purchase the lot And

Speaker 1

27:04 move the tank. Includes paying

Speaker 10

27:07 the prop the current property owners so that they can move the propane tank that is buried in the lot so that it's actually in the lot to the house that it serves. Sits on top actually, doesn't it? Sits on top. Move it. Anyway. Right. Right. Yeah. So that's where the 90 comes from. I believe do you what do you have for the shed? $1.20 ish?

Speaker 1

27:26 Yeah. Somewhere between a 100 and a 100 Okay. And

Speaker 10

27:28 So I believe that may come from the presentation that was made to Town Council about two or three months ago in which we had renderings of a possible three car Three bay. A three car garage Yep. Building on the commons for storage. But rather than building it on the North Commons, we would build it on the new lot. So that's where that number comes from.

Speaker 5

27:51 Okay. Right. So

Speaker 1

27:52 in terms of so our budget here assumes that the lot that the Town Council approves buying the lot which I think it's more likely more than likely not more than likely to go that way than not. And then it assumes that the the expenditure on the actually that's I have that actually in this year which says you would do it before June. July starts the new fiscal year so that 90 could also move over to the other side. And it assumes that building the storage would probably happen and paid for in the 2627 budget.

28:29 That's what that that assumes. So it assumes a $120

Speaker 2

28:33 to build what a metal structure? No.

Speaker 1

28:37 It's 100 it's Okay. 120. Yeah.

Speaker 10

28:39 What what is the structure that is being built? There were there were pictures of there was a possible rendering. It is a here

Speaker 1

28:48 you go. Hey.

Speaker 4

28:52 It's an actual real garage with it's it's not a shed that you pull up off, you know. You put a pad in and put it on. It's a concrete pad and has power. And that's

Speaker 1

29:06 got some scope and an estimate. So that's really by our definitions. I can't even put that in definition. It's probably better defined. You were involved in that too, weren't you Justin? What's that? The, the storage shed, the storage building? Yep. Yeah. Call that I call that a preliminary estimate now. K.

29:29 And you have a question? I do have a question. So

Speaker 7

29:34 as you mentioned, we have 90 being spent this year. This year. In this in this fiscal year's budget. If that is not spent, do we need to put room in '26, '27 It moves over. Land and the building? Yeah. It'll move over, I guess. The l and I can move over? Yeah. Well, okay. Yeah. Okay.

Speaker 1

29:52 Okay. Let's say the Town Council approves purchasing that property and and paying for the storage tank, gas tank removal, a a propane tank removal, would that be actually spent in this fiscal year, or would that not? Depend on... I mean, my assumption

Speaker 10

30:06 is it would depend on what the deal was that was struck with crispy concepts. Yeah. It... I mean, if I was somebody selling a piece of property, I would prefer not to have to wait four months to sell it. But Right. You know, that's part of the real estate deal. So I can't speak Okay. To If the

Speaker 1

30:22 Town Council approves it, I think leaving that expenditure in this fiscal year is the right way to do it. And if it gets delayed enough, then it goes in the other year. So is the Town Council modifying the capital budget for this year? Is that why we're approving two years? We

Speaker 3

30:38 don't know they're gonna do. The

Speaker 10

30:41 capital budget does not have to be readopted in order to spend money. There has to be a...

30:50 I think we're supposed to do everything by ordinances or resolutions. There would have to be a vote by Town Council to spend the money to purchase the lot, but we would not have to readopt a budget. Right. Yeah. The capital

Speaker 1

31:01 the capital plan the capital plan we recommend just goes into to the Town Council's capital budget. They... That doesn't authorize expenditures. Not just a plan for spending. Got it. Okay. Is that is that accurate, Kay? Yes. Thank you. Okay. Park restrooms. We always said this was in conjunction with with the triway trails in the hope in the sense that hopefully if we're going to build these public restrooms on the somewhere near the commons maybe in conjunction with the town office or whatever and we we always said that was a priority too.

31:36 We've got to wait for some of the driveway trails. If this Lowry property is purchased that also could be a place where it would go but it would still need better definition than it has right now and that's why that expenditure is listed out in the fiscal year a year from now.

31:55 Don't know when that would be done. Sidewalks, West Irvington sidewalk, Justin and facilities people are looking at that. You're gonna meet with VDOT on it. Right? Yes. K. I I I left it as a priority three, which is what it always was based on how much it's gonna cost and 500,000 was an estimate that Phil and I discussed just you know dollars per square foot. So it's a it's a ballpark estimate and I don't see right now in having a priority any better than three because

Speaker 9

32:25 it's a lot of money. Where is the cost range of $500 coming from? 500,000? Yeah

Speaker 1

32:32 these are thousands. They're all thousands except for the million where it says million. They're going to put a K up top there. And the 500... Some say K some say don't. It's little confusing. Yeah and I'm going to update that. But think of all those numbers if they don't say million being hundreds of thousands or thousands. So the 500,000 just comes from taking 2,500 square, 2,500 feet linear feet and multiply it by a $150 a square, a linear foot.

33:00 So it's, that's about what we spent on the other sidewalk right? So it's it's based on previous projects. And again we'll see. That's

33:17 why it says available funds grants and if we didn't get a grant we wouldn't do it.

33:24 Steamboat Road to Old Mill Cove Road potential future consideration if the state wants to spend a lot of money. The Triway Trail again future consideration. Is

Speaker 2

33:35 there any update or information on Triway?

Speaker 1

33:39 I don't I don't have any. Does anyone from the Town Council have any Triway Trails information? I know they're they slowed down a little, from where they were. Okay. But I don't I don't think they've gotten anywhere near where we have to get a better handle on it yet. They

Speaker 4

33:56 do have the money for the design to Irvington. Okay. But they don't have the money to build to her. They have the money to build to compass. Yeah.

Speaker 8

34:09 Thought they were waiting for the hospital to be finished to come through there was what I was told.

34:18 It

Speaker 1

34:18 was the money for the property. Yeah it's been moving around a little I know that but I think we're the part that connects to us is is a ways off. Town office. Right now we rent this place and Phil I'll ask you again. Our lease here is do we have like three years of guaranteed and then we have up to five in options? We have three years here

Speaker 4

34:40 And then for the last two years, we leave before five we have to pay 20% of the remaining rent. Okay. What and there's there's there's a

Speaker 1

34:54 number of alternatives for that. Some of the Town Council, one particular person especially, doesn't like the idea of us renting an office forever. When I looked at this and said from our standpoint the facilities committee ought to develop alternatives to the current lease or to continue leasing and consider the alternatives. I don't think at this point there's anything more we can do but you don't want to wait until lease is expiring until you do that because you don't have an alternative.

Speaker 2

35:26 Are we one year into this lease? Not quite. September. Right?

Speaker 4

35:32 August. So

Speaker 1

35:35 we're part of a year into it. Okay. Yeah. Got lots of time. Okay. The the alternatives in my mind that I've discussed with a couple of people were we we had a a potential deal with the Steamboat Museum where we'd modify the museum and rent part of it back. But basically it would be one consolidated place which had a general agreement by a lot of people in the Town Council and a lot of people in the town. We kind of like that too. Another one is to build something separately on the North Commons.

36:03 Another one is to buy something else in town. And I think just studying the alternatives being prepared to either continue to lease or to have a place that we own is something that ought to be considered. I don't know if that satisfies everyone in the Town Council but that's where we are. Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on how we want to present it in any different way than we have on this paper? We've to study it in order to comment on it. Right.

Speaker 2

36:33 I guess another thing is is locating it. One thing that I just have a question about. I don't know the Lowry lot, but is that a sizable does it have density? Or is it just a just for the purpose of It's it's I I understand It's two

Speaker 1

36:50 thirds of an acre. Right? Two thirds of an acre. It's a 105 by two eighty five. Yeah. But just out of curiosity, Phil, would there be enough room there to put a town office and public restrooms in addition to the storage building? No. Well, that's the same answer. Sorry. I'm not gonna I'm I'm I'm Oh, you can't comment because you carry I'm I'm also gonna recommend that the the land that has been offered up

Speaker 10

37:14 runs kind of behind the porta potties, if you will, Marston. And so I'm not really sure that if you think about access for the public to the town office, that it's necessarily the greatest access. I would be worried because people would have to come in off the curb on Chesapeake, I don't think that makes a whole lot of sense, or they'd have to come across the commons, again, don't think that makes a whole lot of sense. So I'm not really sure that it's a great piece of land to think about building a town office on.

37:49 I also would be worried about we'd be putting an office and a storage building and public bathrooms in an otherwise residential neighborhood. So I think there could be some concern from residents as well. So I just I'm not sure that I would

Speaker 1

38:07 recommend that piece of property as a solution to storage and town office. Right. Yeah. So that means like if if we're gonna if we're gonna build something it it could be built on the North or or in our commons, but we really don't wanna lose parking and and play in community activity access there. So The question of the town having to buy another piece of property probably drives the $500,000 town office number up some. The question is can you buy a property or buy a building and get it all ready for $500,000 That maybe in the ballpark, but it's not an obvious answer.

Speaker 7

38:44 So anyway Tom, given the three to five year lease, should we at least put the 500 in 2930 or 3031? Good

Speaker 3

38:55 question. You'd wanna do sooner than that because if you're gonna try to build somewhere, you need to get moving.

Speaker 1

39:02 I guess the other question is if you're studying the alternatives, when do you have to even spend any money on that? Well, just as a placeholder on Yeah. Yeah. No. It's a it's a that's a good point. I think 2028. It says you have to put something out there. Let's put it let's put the 500,000 out in 2829. Just yeah. That's a good idea. State of the art communication infrastructure broadband cell service we've got a committee that's worked worked on that a little bit.

39:30 We talked about hiring consultants possibly might put some money in. I don't see at this point that we're gonna likely to get higher consultants working with the appropriate businesses asking questions they sometimes answer but we understand more of the issues. Traffic calming. I went to one of the Town Council committee meetings. I think Marston in your report we There was a speed sign on in King Carter Drive. Right? It had a pole and so it was physically attractive.

40:08 What was what was the estimated cost of that? I well, I

Speaker 2

40:13 I stopped before going to contractor. Yeah. But the VDOT guy was gave me a whisper number. I'll I'll have to look at it. He said when you it's double what it would be if VDOT wasn't involved. So I'd say that sign is $10.

Speaker 1

40:28 We just need a number in there. Look at it and a send note, text me and say what it is and what you think the quality of the estimate would be so we know. And I think we want to make that a number one priority. I think the Town Council wants to move forward with this thing.

Speaker 2

40:47 Will they get contractor quotes? I

Speaker 1

40:49 don't think we need that at this point. The Town Council can do that.

Speaker 10

40:55 The Staff do that. One thing that

Speaker 1

40:59 was mentioned in one of the discussions was the idea of the portable speed sign. Where you move around and sits on a little trailer. I think there's a couple of them in Kilmarnock. I saw one today. My own personal feeling is that when when you went through that in the plan, the recommendations, that people didn't a lot of people don't like the look of those things. So that's why this thing had a pole on it and it was physically more attractive. And so I don't think we recommend a movable speed trap sign.

41:33 Does anyone have an issue with that?

41:37 The facilities committee can change that of course but I think we want a permanent thing. Is it really going to be moved or is this movable thing going to stick in one place and never be moved? If we build the pole thing that was in Marston's report we don't have that question. That's my point. I agree.

Speaker 6

41:52 What I think we should do. If you really need to have it movable then deal with it. Don't see it being moved.

Speaker 1

42:01 I agree. Crosswalk, Marston same deal. Crosswalk from Kathy's Gardens on the other side of the street I think that should be a number one priority.

42:13 I'll email you also a Great. Specific I'll put those numbers in. They'll both be in next year. Is the pulse on that pretty likely to I think the little thing I was hearing at the meetings, Town Council seemed interested in doing that. Okay. Yeah. Cool. I'll get a because they were some of the few things we thought we could do about traffic coming. Yeah. Does that crosswalk have to wait for the Triway Trail location

Speaker 2

42:37 to be specified? No. We kind of know where that is and we're citing it to be there. Okay. It had to go nominally where this this where

Speaker 1

42:46 the plan put it. The Triway Trails thing the last time I saw it they had it ending in the driveway parking lot of the dredge. I think we wanted to go over to the commons and exactly where they crossed the street is the only issue.

Speaker 2

43:04 No. But I think that the property owners kind of have a sense. And we were well,

Speaker 1

43:10 I think we're gonna put this this crosswalk In that would the right spot. It could and the Triway Trail could use that. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Right. Okay. That that's that's all I had in here. Does anyone have anything here they wanna change or add or subtract?

Speaker 2

43:32 Okay.

Speaker 1

43:33 I will revise this based on that. Do I have a motion to approve this in its revised form to be forwarded to the Town Council?

Speaker 7

43:41 So moved. Second.

Speaker 1

43:45 Any further discussion? All in favor? Aye. Great. Unanimous. Thank you everybody. I think for future years we might want to start on this earlier so I don't have to do it and allocate things out to people so they can look into in more detail because the only thing here we really did on our own is the traffic calming came from Marston's report. Okay. That was excellent. Still wonderful. An hour. Okay. Roundtable. Any other issues anybody has?

44:24 Steve? Nope. David? Vivian? Nope. Marston? Good. Bruce? Nope. Jeremy? Nothing. Me neither. Okay. Next meeting, the TC meeting on Thursday. There's also, as Kay mentioned earlier, the the budget. Is that a workshop, Kay? Yes. It's a workshop. Okay. A budget workshop prior to meeting where they'll present the the town budget and the capital plan then and set the the the workshops at 05:30. Right, Kay? Yes, sir. Okay. And the quorum's required for the 06:30 meeting which we discussed in our next meeting is May 5.

Speaker 2

45:00 Cinco de Mayo. Great. Do do

Speaker 1

45:03 I have a motion motion to adjourn? So moved. Second. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Thanks everybody for coming. Thanks. Under an hour.